I would think that Saruman, a Maia, would be in that category. See Palantr Wikipedia . Elbereth Vala Varda said: Saruman fell to darkness regardless. Instead of sending armies out to take Minas Tirith, Sauron would have had the majority of his forces concentrated on his borders and sweeping the land in front of it with orcs, men, trolls, and Nazgul. Tolkien's complex writings and retcons don't reveal a crystal-clear answer about Saruman arriving first, but if you go by The Silmarillion, Saruman did. 4 What if Saruman had never been corrupted? That success would be the usual bitter victory, though, because first the new wielder of the ring would need to build his own power, and learn the mastery of the ring. . Maybe, though i dont know that much about Sauman's power and. What If Sauron Recovered the One Ring in Lord of the Rings? 2023 Minute Media - All Rights Reserved. Tolkien. If Saruman destroyed Sauron If he won, he would become a great L. He aided Frodo but he did not save him or the Quest from certain ruin as Eomer did by attacking the orc band. There's the slight possibility that Saruman would have given the One Ring to Sauron and served as lieutenant to the most powerful being in Middle-earth. Unfortunately, Sauron had got on the wrong side of a particularly powerful race: the Nmenreans.The isle of Nmenr was a realm of men that sat apart from Middle-earth and those who lived there were more powerful than the men seen elsewhere in The Lord of . They were basically the teachers pet ones who lived closest to the Valar and did not trouble themselves (except once) with the problems of Middle-Earth. With possession of the one ring he would have replaced Sauron (would have wiped him out entirely). The Lord of the Rings. Lord Of The Rings: 20 Strange Things About Saruman's Anatomy - ScreenRant We'll probably never know. Saruman wants to be Sauron's . There's this passage that describes what happened after the death of his physical body: To the dismay of those that stood by, about the body of Saruman a grey mist gathered, and rising slowly to a great height like smoke from a fire, as a pale shrouded figure it loomed over the Hill. First its a lucky hit, now its a super-human with a magical super-sword? It may have taken a while to learn to use the Ring to its full potential, and Sauron would surely have put everything he had behind trying to get it back, but itd be iffy, and he certainly couldnt use the Nazgul or other ring-empowered creatures against the weilder of the One. Gandalf and Galadriel both seem to think that they could take the One, and replace Sauron - if they can so could Saruman. Will to conquer all life in Middle-earth was the last bit I believe. That's when the Rohirrim attacked, allowing the Hobbits to escape into Fangorn forest. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. By this Tolkien shows that disobedience for good reasons has merit. On one side the true allegiance of the Ring to Sauron; on the other superior strength because Sauron was not actually in possession, and perhaps also because he was weakened by long corruption and expenditure of will in dominating inferiors. And they are similar to, if slightly less powerful than, the Maiar? They could not fight him, since it was under Saurons power they were made, but they did distract him - Sauron was concentrating his sight and attantion upon Rivendell and Lothlorien. But what does Saruman do now? Sorry, memory fails me ATM. Would he have given the Ring back to Sauron or would he have kept the ring and contested Sauron for power over Middle-earth? It didn't have to shoot out lighting bolts to be an uber blade. We know that one of the elven rings was gifted to Gandalf. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for LEGO The Lord of the Rings Tower of Orthanc (10237) at the best online prices at eBay! #2. If Saruman masters the ring, he will have a chance of defeating Sauron. Feel free to contact him by email at hawkins.blake12@gmail.com, or find him on Facebook. This perfectly explained how the Ring could have gotten from Sauron to Isildur to Gollum to . Saruman had an opportunity to take a Ring of Power, but didn't. Was the ring more risk than it was worth? Saruman didn't know what Gandalf wanted to say, but he could guess. The situation in The Lord of the Rings was pretty dire. Saruman is one of few "grey" characters in the books, meaning he's neither gone fully evil or good. Elemental Staffs. The question of what Saruman would have done therefore becomes moot since it seems inevitable that Sauron would have been the stronger. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. When Gandalf sent Frodo and the Hobbits to Bree in The Lord of the Rings' opening act, he had the fullest intent of meeting them there. mostly minifigs and decorated bricks. It's a good question. How did Saruman become corrupted? These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. Furthermore, Saruman knows more about ring-lore than any other being in Middle Earth at the time, save only Sauron himself, and he had already made himself a minor ring, so he would learn how to use it quickly. He would simply wait and let the Ring do what it was made to do. To a lesser degree Faramir's disobedience also saved the Quest. However, you may visit "Cookie Settings" to provide a controlled consent. Five wizards came to Middle-earth, so the Stranger could be any of them. Sauron would also realize the captured Halflings did not have the Ring so all the doubt surrounding Aragorn having it would be absent. Why are trials on "Law & Order" in the New York Supreme Court? Come join us to discuss the works of Tolkien. Saruman was corrupted already so was a good candidate for the One Ring, through him it could exert Sauron's will to enslave all Middle-earth. Saruman used the seeing stones(palintir) to keep up with Sauron, as did Boromirs Father (name slips me now), Sarumaon would be no more than a snivinling fool of Sauron. The free people of Middle-earth had possession of Sauron's One Ring, but that was only a minor Read more on cbr.com. In the book it is sort of implied that certain beings with sufficient power (e.g. What if Saruman had never been corrupted? If Saruman had not been corrupted in the first place, the war might have gone much easier for the Free Peoples. The orcs likely would have gotten to Isengard the next day or so or met Saruman on the way as he or his image was seen by Aragorn and Company on the evening of the 30th. Saruman was most skilled in Ring Lore, save Sauron. But why do I think the Stranger is Saruman? Courage to ones fellows, hope in adversity, and comfort to the suffering were the powers enhanced by the three. I also assume that Sauron would have eventually won the war. Either way, Saruman through torture or his Voice would have quickly learned everything about the Quest of the Ring. Saruman's Journey - Chapter 19 - Uvatha_the_Horseman - The Lord of the A couple of points to add to the excellent arguments thus far: This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. 2463, Saruman was appointed its leader.Even then, he had begun to sense the resurgence of Sauron and to envy and desire his power, and especially his One Ring.Coincidentally, in that same year the One Ring was found by the creature Gollum, drawing the Dark Lord closer to the conflict that would eventually prove Saruman's undoing. What if Saruman had got the Ring? | SpaceBattles Forums I don't think it would have made Saruman invincible, and, after all, he still would still have had to contend for instance with Treebeard and the Ents, as well as with Sauron. It only takes a minute to sign up. We don't know enough about the powers of the Ring, in the hands of an ambitious wizard how it might have worked as a "devastating weapon" (Letter 246), how, as a symbol, it might in Saruman's hands have affected Sauron's servants and vassals. Privacy Policy. I think people project a kind of loaded weapon mentality onto the rings which is misleading. On the other hand, if the Stranger is Saruman, consider that journey and how it makes his transformation all the more tragic. Letter 246 describes a hypothetical confrontation between a hypothetical Ring-bearing Gandalf and Sauron: Confrontation of Sauron alone, unaided, self to self was not contemplated. He concealed his identity and ran away whenever he was confronted. Ummm, thats what the One Ring does for someone who has zero magical ability. LOTR: Why Didn't Saruman Take Gandalf's Ring Of Power On Orthanc? Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0, TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History, Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News. 1. It's much more likely that Saruman would have used the One Ring for himself and tried to claim Middle-earth as his own. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. He's the anti-hero in his own story who spends time with the Blue Wizards in the East, heads up the White Council, and eventually . He now lives with his family in Lynchburg VA and is an avid outdoorsman. JavaScript is disabled. -----Also check out our other channels!The 6th Ranger - (For all things Power Rangers! However, that's not the most likely scenario. He fought Uruk-hai (who had captured Merry and Pippin thinking they were Frodo) and were enroute to Isengard. This one, too, was controlled by Sauron. By clicking Accept All, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. Through them Tolkien shows Faramir and Eomer's quality was in not being blind followers of loyalty and obedience to king and father but seeing a bigger picture and being obedient to a greater purpose. A normal man with a normal sword would probably have failed miserably even if he had got in the lucky hit. He and Nori leave for the land in the east at the end of The Rings of Power season one finale. He would soon surmise Saruman didn't have the Ring and the two halflings were ringers. Sauron originally made the One Ring to enhance his ability to influence and suppress or control the wills of other beings, specifically the Children of Ilvatar (Elves, Dwarves, and Men). So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. It's interesting here that since both Sauron and Saruman were in origin Maiar of Aule, they may be expected to have some knowledge of each other, and that they would have some idea of each other's strengths and weaknesses. He also used his Palantir to spy on Sauron. Opens in new tab Opens in new tab Opens in new tab. Tolkiens trilogy its even plastered on the cover of several editions of the books. Even if Saruman won this hypothetical battle, it would be ultimately irrelevant. Would the One Ring even work for anyone but Sauron? What if Saruman hadn't gone bad? | The Tolkien Forum (Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age, The Silmarillion as far as the quoted material here goes). What happened to Saruman(after he died)? : r/tolkienfans - reddit Sauron would then have suspended his campaign against Minas Tirith, and instead sent his armies north-west, through Rohan towards Isengard. Knowing where he ends up would make the Strangers current journey all the more fascinating. In Tolkiens writings, they came across the sea. Any idea what set any of these are from? Basically it took a super-human with a super-sword to chop the ring off of Sauron's hand and he only did that with a lucky hit. Even from afar he had an effect upon it, to make it work for its return to himself. That Saruman is nothing like the Stranger who falls from the sky in The Rings of Power. He definitely volunteered to go to Middle-earth first. Be specific and add in your sources, we prefer not to have speculation here. Without Gandalf, King Theoden would likely remain under the control of Saruman. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Frodo was a hobbit with one companion, in the heart of Sauron's realm. What would happen if Gandalf had the ring? Powered by Discourse, best viewed with JavaScript enabled. It basically lets them look unique according to their enchantment. The thing is, that wouldn't be a simple task. The Silmarillion says Saruman was the eldest Istari and came first. What money is available for senior citizens? I suspect that most of us think Saruman's treachery is so fundamental to Lord of the Rings, that it is almost impossible to imagine the epic without it. Lord of the Rings Characters That Should Totally Get Their Own Movies All the latest gaming news, game reviews and trailers. Did Aragorn ever offer the ring to Frodo? What if Eomer's hadn't disobey his King? The merit of disobedience https://www.teespring.com/stores/historyoftheagesAlso here are our other social media links too! First of all: Yes, you probably should watch at least The Two Towers before reading much further: that movie is all about Saruman's plans and schemes.. Having said that, there's a combination of things that have driven Saruman to act the way he does in the Lord of the Rings trilogy. What Would Happen if Saruman Got the One Ring in LOTR? Its probably been done already, and if so I apologize, but: If Saruman had gotten his greedy lil mitts on the one ring, would he have been able to set himself up as a new dark lord (or however they call themselves)? You are using an out of date browser. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. Posted September 4, 2007. mysticalblues said: My roommate met someone last week that had a ring that she got in St. Thomas. Today we jump back in time to one of our older videos at one of our What If scenarios! After all, he was extremely powerful in his own right. Rohan would've fallen to Saruman and wouldn't have been able to come to the aid of Gondor and helped make the final stand against the forces of Mordor at the Black Gate. Chief among the powers of the ring that were feared by the White Council was the fact that if Sauron put it on now, all that had been done by the Wise using the three rings would be revealed to him, as would their minds, if they did not take off the rings. He says: "Even reckoned as a lord and captain Saruman has grown very strong Saruman also had a mind to capture the Ring for himself [Sauron] now has Isengard to fear as well as Minas Tirith" The word "fear" seems important here. Saruman knew good and well what would happen when he tried holding Gandalf. The chapter is a partly published version of a manuscript now held at the Marquette University (MSS 4/2/31-37); [1] other parts of this manuscript and a time scheme have been included in The . Middle-earth & J.R.R. Just like when Sauron, arguably the most powerful 'mage' of that time, did during the last alliance the one where he lost due to a mere human? Saruman arrived in Middle-earth midway through the Third Age, along with Gandalf and Radagast. When Gandalf sent Frodo and the Hobbits to Bree in The Lord of the Rings' opening act, he had the fullest intent of meeting them there. You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. The one, and the nine created fearful dominance, fraught with majesty, and terror. 1 What would have happened if Saruman got the ring? 12 Best Skyrim Staff Mods - Gaming - MOW Lord Of The Rings: Sauron's Rise (& Defeat) In The - ScreenRant Either way, the battle between them would have been a catastrophic lose-lose situation for everyone. Gandalf found out that Saruman had abandoned his mission when the White Wizard asked him to join forces with Sauron. Middle-earth & J.R.R. Tolkien Blog - by Michael Martinez Hes of the same order of beings as Sauron, so he certainly has enough power to effectively use the ring. Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? His actions were more indirect as his decision was of non-action in not taking Frodo to Minas Tirith. The Great Eye also features heavily in Peter Jacksons blockbuster big-screen adaptations, an ever-watchful flaming orb atop a massive stone obelisk. Ar Pharazon the Golden defeated Sauron, before he lost the ring, and he was just a Numenorean. If you know how to use it, its an *extremely* powerful magical artifact. In what way? Why did Saruman seem to believe that Sauron wouldn't return? The Lord of the Rings; Middle-Earth (Franchise) entertainment news If he could obtain or recreate the One Ring for himself, he would be able to rule Middle-earth just like Sauron did. Avenue Magazine editor Peter Davis gets engaged on Vail mountaintop Answer (1 of 3): In short: nobody else could use it against him. What about Galadrial? This is the real reason the eagles question will never die: Its too appetizing for The Lord of the Rings fans. And so that's what Gandalf was pretending to do, while they were actually taking the Ring to Mt. Does he use his great voice, enhanced by the One to subjugate the free peoples. If any artists would like us to remove their artwork, or add anything additional to credit you, please contact us and we will sort it straight away! Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. The Uruk-hai capture Frodo and Sam at Amon Hen, thus Saruman gains possession of the most powerful of the Rings of Power, which carries in it, a greater part of Sauron's inherent might. St. Thomas Gem stone question - Carnival Cruise Lines - Cruise Critic What was Saruman's motivation in the Lord of the Rings trilogy? When the good wizard Saruman uses one to spy on the peoples of Middle-earth, he is drawn in by its power and ensnared by . Was he not already the warlord of a growing realm, a commander of orcs and men? The Lord Of The Rings: 10 'What If' Scenarios That Would Change Everything Saruman with the Ring would presumably have tried to do what Tolkien says Galadriel or Gandalf might have done, if they have succumbed to the temptation of accepting the Ring: "they would have built up an empire with great and absolutely subservient generals and armies and engines of war, until they could challenge Sauron and destroy him by force." However, The Lord of the Rings TV series still left plenty of questions for future seasons. the scene in which Gandalf, say, was placed in such a position. So He would do what He did after His defeat by Isildur. Saruman also experimented with the making of a Ring of his own. The Palantri. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics". I recall the Narsil having been forged by the elves, using elvish magic. If he could obtain or recreate the One Ring for himself, he would be able to rule Middle-earth just like Sauron did. After a comment from Gimli, Gandalf adds: "But Isengard cannot fight Mordor, unless Saruman first obtains the Ring. In the books it is mentioned several times that Sauron fears one of the uber good guys getting hold of the Ring. It seems it was a mistake for the Ring to leave Isildur. RELATED: The Lord of the Rings: 10 Details About Sauron's Costume You Never Noticed This incident, one of those that was invented for the film to increase tension, is an incredible missed opportunity for the minions of the Dark . But what if the Stranger is a different wizard we all know from The Lord of the Rings? He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? Since both are immortal, Saruman is going to be tortured for a long, long, long, long, LONG time. Hypothetical question: What would happen if Saruman gained the One Ring The Lord of the Rings (LOTR) by J. R. R. Tolkien is one of the greatest and most famous epic fantasy series in English literature. If any being who had the power to use the Ring to its full potential had gotten ahold of it, that being would have been able to easily take on Sauron. What Would Happen if Saruman Got the One Ring in LOTR? Earlier in the same letter we see just exactly how useful the Ring would have been to a hypothetical Ring-bearing Saruman (or anyone else, for that matter): Sauron would not have feared the Ring! The implication is that Saruman has to defeat Sauron. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. What if the balrog got the ring? : r/tolkienfans - reddit Saruman volunteered. With the more powerful becoming all the more corrupted. Sauron may not learn the true goal of the Ringbearer but he would know that the ringbearer was most likely near or nearing his borders. Well Gandalf and Galadriel were pretty confident in their ability to defeat Sauron using One Ring! IIRC the idea of Galadriel taking it scared the bejeezus out of him. These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. They sang in the Music or the Ainur and were commanders of Morgoth's armies. What are the benefits of digital signatures? It allowed him to recover multiple times after his physical body got destroyed. Functional cookies help to perform certain functionalities like sharing the content of the website on social media platforms, collect feedbacks, and other third-party features. There was a Winged Nazgul operating near the area as well on the other side of the Anduin and thus closer to Frodo. 5 Who controlled the Seeing Stone of Minas Anor? What happens next? At the beginning of the story, Saruman is more powerful than Gandalf. So if Saruman mastered the Ring, he would become the next Dark Lord of Middle-earth. Yet, it's also possible that Sauron would have triumphed and regained the Ring for himself. With the more powerful becoming all the more corrupted. My understanding of the crushingly unavoidable fate which is the history of Middle Earth says that the One Ring belongs to Sauron and no other. We know that disobedience can bring ruin such as what happened with the Noldor when they disobeyed the Valar or the Army of the Dead when they disobeyed Isildur and broke their oath to fight for him. Saruman later describes himself as "Ring-maker" when taunting Gandalf. If Gandalf proved the victor, the result would have been for Sauron the same as the destruction of the Ring; for him it would have been destroyed, taken from him for ever. How might the Ring have helped Saruman in his empire-building? What would have happened if Saruman had gotten the One Ring? For all things Tolkien, Lord of The Rings, and The Hobbit Press J to jump to the feed. Did Peter Jackson take inspiration for Gollum from "Dracula 1931" movie. Probably, upon creation, Saruman was weaker than Gandalf and Sauron, and he spent his entire existence trying to increase his power, leading to his jealousy of Gandalf and eventual betrayal. The Ring still wants to be with its true master. JavaScript is disabled. He still had the nine, and perhaps some of the seven. Please message us if we have not credited you! What percentage of recruits fail boot camp? These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. Both the direct and symbolic aspects could have helped Saruman expand his empire by winning adherents and frightening potential opponents. How to watch all 'The Lord of the Rings' movies and series in Mostly, though, he most enjoys writing about Star Wars. What If SARUMAN managed to get his hands on the One Ring and how that . Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. In the Silmarillion we have Iluvatar's strongest creation falling from grace.In many ways Saruman's fall is the 3rd Age equivalent. In Middle-earth history, it seems likely Saruman arrived before Gandalf did. When it comes to the Stranger, played by Daniel Weyman, we learned he is one of the Istari, but we did not learn his actual name. In Rivendell, Frodo all but offers the Ring to Aragorn, saying Then it belongs to you, and not to me at all! (FOTR260). Saruman was a wizard and warlord, in a fortress controlled by himself, garrisoned by orcs and men, and separated from Mordor by regions which were not Sauron-friendly. As Sauron once was, Saruman, a Maia of Aule, became absorbed in Ring-lore as he studied Sauron's evil works. [ST:TNG] The First Duty what if there had been no accident? In the case of vague powers the One Ring would enhance one's powers based on one's strengths. The Ring merely corrupted you, it did not control you. Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. He is Maiar. Galadriel and Gandalf each made a conscious decision not to embark on such a course; but Saruman would not have hesitated. Gandalf & Galadriel admitted they would eventually fall to evil will of Sauron through the One Ring. In the case of Sauron it increased his ability to deceive people, entice people to his will, made him stronger and faster then he had been, wiser in the use of his raw poweress, "and he could see and govern the very thoughts of those that wore the lesser Rings of Power." In The Lord of the Rings, the palantri corrupt nearly all who use them. Lots of great, exclusive content, even discounts on our original merch! Many of the vague abilities listed above are also part and parcel to those abilities listed below. Stevensville Montana Murders, Accident In Minerva Ohio Today, Washington State Property Tax Exemption For 100% Disabled Veteran, Crescent Lake Florida Alligators, What Does Unspent Non Motoring Convictions Mean, Articles W
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